Creating Impact Through Immigration Law: How Ayesha Chidolue Built Her 52-Person Firm 🇳🇬

Lola

00:00 - 00:36

Hey there, welcome to the Kadara Woman podcast, where we amplify the untold impact-driven stories of remarkable African women making waves across the globe. I'm your host, Lola Soyebo Harris. All right, so today's episode is with the incredible Ayesha Chidolue, and it is refreshingly inspiring. She's this amazing immigration attorney who's built her law firm from scratch, and she takes us through her journey from working in corporate America to deciding to build her own firm. She shares how she balanced career pivots with being a mom and how she also grew her team from just herself to 52 people.

Lola

00:37 - 01:11

So if you've ever thought about creating something meaningful that aligns with your values, I think you're going to love this conversation. Ayesha keeps it real about the challenges of being an entrepreneur, the fares, and even working with her husband as her COO. From her childhood dream of becoming a lawyer to landing on the Inc. 5000 list, her story shows us that with laser focus and a little bit of faith, you can absolutely create something amazing. So settle in and let's dive into this conversation with Ayesha. Oh, well, hello, hello, Ayesha. How are you doing? You look good.

Lola

01:11 - 01:19

I'm doing good. Hi, Lola. How are you? I'm good. I'm loving the red on you. You know, that's my signature look.

Ayesha

01:20 - 01:20

That's my

Lola

01:20 - 01:20

signature

Ayesha

01:20 - 01:20

look.

Lola

01:21 - 01:26

Oh, okay. With the stripes. Okay, you can't actually wear Well, kind of like matching a little bit. We are.

Ayesha

01:26 - 01:27

Is that purple or

Lola

01:27 - 01:28

blue? Mine is like navy

Ayesha

01:28 - 01:28

blue. It's

Lola

01:28 - 01:30

like navy bluish. I

Ayesha

01:30 - 01:31

don't know. Mine

Lola

01:31 - 01:32

is navy blue too. Yeah, I

Ayesha

01:32 - 01:32

got it from

Lola

01:32 - 01:35

a vendor in Nigeria if I have to do a mini

Ayesha

01:35 - 01:35

shout

Lola

01:35 - 01:36

out. So,

Ayesha

01:36 - 01:36

you

Lola

01:36 - 02:05

know. Give me a shout out. That's what we do. All right. Well, so for the listeners, I actually do a narration from a former life. Well, not former, former life. It's still the same life. Yeah, it's still the same life. Friendship life. Formal life is more like corporate life, you know? Yeah. And so I would love for us to just start from the very beginning. And one question I love to ask the guests of the show is, you know, the heritage and what African country they come from and how that's influenced the woman they are today.

Ayesha

02:06 - 02:37

Um, for me, I am Nigerian. Um, I was born in Texas, funny enough. Oh, you were? I sure was. I was born in Houston. Houston. What? I know. Baby Lagos. Baby Lagos. Baby Lagos, right? And you know, um, yeah, I was, um, me and my older sister and younger brother. And my dad at the time was a professor. And then, you know, when we were like young, like, you know, three, four, five years old, we all moved back to Nigeria. And, you know, I lived in Nigeria until I was 17. and then we came back here from college.

Ayesha

02:37 - 03:10

So for me, my formative years was really spent in Nigeria and it has definitely shaped the woman that I am because, you know, one thing about Nigerians and you see that just across the board is we have a grit that is hard to explain unless you are part of the culture or understand the culture. And the ambition to be successful, you know, and I think it has a lot to do with you know, for most Nigerians, there's, there's no, there's nothing that's not an option. Like when you're around people that are successful, you aspire to be successful.

Ayesha

03:10 - 03:40

There's nothing that's off the table for you. So I think that bringing that, you know, when I came back to America, you know, when people are like, Oh, you know, how are you able to do this? Or how are you able to do that? You know, it has a lot to do with your mindset. And that mindset came from growing up there. So, you know, I was worried with my kids who are growing up here in America, for instance, like, So I try to really instill in them what it is that I learned from Nigeria, even though they're around a different environment and they're growing up here in America.

Ayesha

03:40 - 03:55

And I definitely see that seeping in, in their level of drive and ambition. You know, but sometimes you gotta ruffle them a little bit and remind them again, listen, you're Nigerian, you can't be doing this. So yeah, that's my heritage and I think what has shaped who I am today.

Lola

03:55 - 04:01

That's great. And so you said you came to the States when you were 17. Do you remember what you wanted to be when you were younger? Oh,

Ayesha

04:02 - 04:03

yeah. I wanted to be a lawyer.

Lola

04:04 - 04:05

Oh, you've always wanted to be a lawyer.

Ayesha

04:05 - 04:08

Always, always, always. Where did that come

Lola

04:08 - 04:08

from?

Ayesha

04:08 - 04:40

In sixth grade, I was in a play. I went to Corona primary school and we did a play called Trials of Brother Jero. And I was a lawyer, you know, and I was like, this is so fun. And I just really enjoyed advocating for people. I think personality wise, I'm just someone who. is big on advocating for the underdog. And I knew I had to be in a profession that would allow me to do that. So I was very laser focused on that being my goal. I know a lot of people, what they want to do when they're younger is not necessarily what they do or they pivot.

Ayesha

04:41 - 05:08

but I was very, very clear that that was what I wanted to do. So even though I came here and I obviously went through different paths, as you know me personally, like took a step back to be a mom or whatever, I always knew that I wanted to get back in the legal space. My start out as an attorney wasn't necessarily the one I wanted, you know, but I've ended up where I think I'm the most passionate about and where I feel my impact greatly.

Lola

05:08 - 05:27

Well, let's even unpack that, right? So first of all, the fact that you knew what you wanted to be that young and you actually became it is, to your point, a lot of people pivot later on in life. There's nothing wrong with that too, but I think it's very amazing that you actually stuck to that dream and you actually are still doing it, which means you like it. And the reason

Ayesha

05:27 - 05:27

why

Lola

05:27 - 05:48

we know we like it is because you have your own firm. But before that, you obviously worked in corporate America for a couple of years, and you mentioned it to yourself where it took you a while to get to the actual field or type of law you wanted to do. Do you want to talk about how you made that transition from corporate and how that was And actually what made you go

Ayesha

05:48 - 06:29

start your own thing? Listen, if you knew me when I graduated from law school, I graduated from law school in 2005. So basically this is my 20th year, by the way, you know, I would never have ever guessed or agreed that I would ever own my own firm. So, so let's get that out of the way. You know, when I started, I was in mergers and acquisition. I was doing like derivative class actions for like shareholders dealing with like large billion dollar, million dollar corporations working on wall street. And while it has its benefits income-wise, it wasn't fulfilling for me because, again, like, I really wanted advocacy for people that I could directly reach or impact.

Ayesha

06:30 - 07:02

And so it just ended up being a job that I was doing because, you know, you've graduated law school, you need to make a living. But I just couldn't see this as my life. While doing that, I actually picked up a hobby. And that was wedding photography and just lifestyle photography. And it started out as a hobby, just doing like friends' weddings and then started Bedazzled Photography. And so I was doing that on the side while I was working in corporate America as an attorney. And a lot of people used to be like, how? Like those are two different avenues.

Ayesha

07:03 - 07:35

But again, because I'm someone that wants to work in an area where there's impact and what is more impactful than giving someone pictures of the day that they look the most beautiful, feel the most beautiful, feel the most happy. And so it was a very fulfilling hobby that turned into like a nice side hustle. You know, I traveled a lot like internationally and, you know, domestically, like to shoot people's weddings. And then, you know, I fell in love. You know, I met someone who lived in a completely different state. My husband at the time was in Arizona.

Ayesha

07:35 - 07:57

And logistically, it made sense for me to move to Arizona and, you know, worked again in corporate legal there for a couple of months. And then, you know, we were expecting our first child. And I just was like, I want to take some time off. Like, I just want to have some time with my And I think, Lola, we were actually pregnant at the same time. Yes,

Lola

07:57 - 07:58

we were.

Ayesha

07:58 - 08:04

That was probably our second, because we talked for eight months. But you

Lola

08:04 - 08:05

had the girls, I had the boys.

Ayesha

08:05 - 08:21

Yeah, I had the girls, because you have the March baby. Yeah, March and May. Yeah. So mine are, you know, April and March. So we were literally always pregnant at the same time. And doing crafts, by the way, guys, we were like painting our kids' rooms and like doing all

Speaker 3

08:21 - 08:22

the decorations

Ayesha

08:23 - 09:02

and stuff like that. So I, you know, I told my husband, you know, I really, I'm not happy here in Arizona. It just felt really lonely. It felt really far away because, you know, everybody else I knew was on the East Coast. So time zone wise, even if you wanted to talk to someone, they were at work and I wasn't working, you know, like I was just, like being pregnant and i was like no you know like i need to use my brain and so my husband ended up finding a job in um florida and then we ended up Moving when I was nine months pregnant, by the way, never do that Yeah, like so first of all finding a doctor that would be willing to take you You know was very stressful.

Ayesha

09:02 - 09:33

So, you know once I had my daughter I was like, okay, you know in 12 weeks, you know, I'll go to You have to get licensed in Florida right license of Florida, but I had no idea that how difficult it was raising an infant or like being with an infant. So, I mean, at 12 weeks, of course, I couldn't take the bar. I was barely catching up on sleep. It was a joke. It was a joke. So I was like, OK, this is not happening. At that point, I continued to do like photography just here and there.

Ayesha

09:34 - 10:05

And then, you know, the next day I was pregnant with my second daughter, Naomi. And at that time, just the weight of the equipment was just too much for me. I just was like, you know, I'm going to just take a step back from photography because I can't be waddling at like seven months pregnant, like squatting down to take pictures and all that. And, you know, I just really wanted to think about what I wanted to do at that time. And, you know, I said, If I'm going to go back to law, I have to have some sort of human impact or interaction.

Ayesha

10:05 - 10:37

I even tried like the human resources route, you know, for like a couple of years. And while I was there, and I saw how much the company was working for was using me for my legal skills. even though they weren't paying me for my legal skills. I was like, what am I doing here? Like, you know, I have, I have a law degree. Okay, maybe I didn't like what I did, but I can always go directly to business owners because at the time I had picked an interest with intellectual property and trademark and copyright and I started doing that while still working there.

Ayesha

10:37 - 11:05

You know, I'm a proponent for having a game plan, just never just jumping into the water without a game plan. And especially, you know, when you have kids now, you really have to think about what it is you're doing. I started taking clients and, you know, I gave myself a year to see how busy I was. And I told myself, once I'm able to make the same amount of income that I'm making in that job, I'm exiting. And so after a year doing that part-time, I was able to get there and I was like, okay, you know.

Ayesha

11:06 - 11:43

Did you have to redo your license? I did. I did. But not at 12 weeks. Yeah, not at 12 weeks. So I didn't end up doing it till my second child was like 18 months. I spent two months studying while I had a two-year-old essentially and a four-year-old. And at the time I was working full-time. So like I would study on Saturdays. I would be in the library from like 9 to 5 p.m. I'm studying and then when I would come back from work just you know do things with the kids and I will then study from like 9 to midnight.

Ayesha

11:43 - 12:13

And you know I just want to give a shout out to my husband. It's so important as women to have supportive partners that understand and see the vision because he had to be on board for it to work. You know, I told him, I said, the only way that I know how to study for the bar is I have to be free from distraction. We literally had to cut off the cable because at the time I used to love watching Real Housewives and all of those things. So I needed to cut out anything that would tempt me, go watch it instead of studying for two months.

Ayesha

12:14 - 12:47

And that was a sacrifice that he was willing to make. So I took the bar and I passed it. And so that's how I started taking business clients and doing intellectual property. I remember my first client was actually another, probably Kadara women that you should interview if you've not interviewed her, Clever Girl Finance. And I remember, you know, saying, you know, let me do your trademark for you or whatever it is. You're going to be my first client. And she was starting her business. And I think it's so important as women that kind of find people that are in the same space as you and trying to grow the same way.

Ayesha

12:47 - 13:12

And so we, you know, piggybacked off each other. So our businesses are the same age because She would give me ideas and show me logos that she was trying to do, what she was trying to do, and I would show her. So even though we had two different businesses where hers was finance-related and mine was legal, I think the synergy or the energy, you know, with somebody else saying, keep going, don't give up, and both of us leaving our corporate jobs, You know, at the same time, it was very impactful knowing that, you know, you had someone else to sound that off to.

Ayesha

13:12 - 13:44

And again, I didn't think that I would be doing immigration because I just didn't think that I would be doing immigration because, you know, my background was in business. And then a lot of the clients, I started getting international clients. And those international clients, even though they were business clients, started asking me about immigration. And they started asking me about immigration. And I was like, OK, let me just do some research. I was like, oh, you know, this is interesting. You know, like, it just started getting a little interesting to me. And then my younger brother, who, unlike the rest of us, you know, we're four kids.

Ayesha

13:44 - 14:14

And, you know, the first three of us were born in America. My youngest one wasn't. So his path to a green card in the United States was very difficult. And, you know, it's hard to watch a member of your family see everybody else as a U.S. citizen and that person doesn't have their status and just seeing the struggle that he went through because, you know, once you get over a certain age, the timeline changes. It just really made me realize outside of myself what it looks like to be an immigrant because it didn't get closer than that.

Ayesha

14:14 - 14:48

Because, you know, yeah, you know, I filed for my parents and my sister filed for my mom. I filed for my dad once we turned 21. But again, we're in Nigeria, you know, coming here, but, you know, seeing your sibling that was born in the same household as you struggling because of their status, I was like, let me, let me just start, you know, understanding this and understanding why he can't get his status. And, you know, from doing that, that's really how immigration was born. And really my practice really became, you know, I started this firm in 2016.

Ayesha

14:49 - 15:17

I really didn't start immigration until 2019, but it's now I'm fully immigration that we do just because The impact is so great. People that don't, their lives don't cross with immigration, don't understand. And you know, they demonize or think that immigrants are the bad guys. But until you're able to walk a day in the shoe of an immigrant or someone that's a foreigner being in a country, like the sacrifice that they're making to be here because it's that bad, you won't have any idea.

Lola

15:18 - 15:29

Yeah. Well, I love that you actually did a full circle there because I think it sounds like at the end of the day, you landed in this sweet spot because of your own personal connection to immigration.

Ayesha

15:29 - 15:29

There's

Lola

15:29 - 15:41

something you said earlier about being an immigrant, I could relate to, which is we are also different immigrants. Yes, we all came at a young age, but if you have your status, you're still a different immigrant than the person who has no status. And

Ayesha

15:41 - 15:41

to

Lola

15:41 - 15:44

your point, a lot of people don't still even understand what that means.

Ayesha

15:45 - 15:45

Right.

Lola

15:45 - 16:17

And so you also touched on just seeing the impact of the work you do now, which was important to you back then. And I love that you were able to get to that space and you've been in that, what, let me do some quick math now, six years, almost nine years, right? Yeah. So when you were building your practice, did you have an idea of like, I know you started out with IP and trademark law, but did you have an idea of what your practice was going to stand for. Again, you come from corporate America and I say that because I know you're quite intentional and you're even speaking about that right now.

Lola

16:18 - 16:23

Just have an impact and put in faces behind the word immigration. It's part of what you

Ayesha

16:23 - 16:24

do. You're

Lola

16:24 - 16:29

very passionate about it. So yeah, did you have an idea even going in what you wanted your firm to stand

Ayesha

16:29 - 16:58

for? I think every area that I picked was very intentional because of my background. For me, watching my mom be a small business owner, even my grandmother before she passed away was a small business owner. And my mom came back to the United States in her 60s. And coming back to the United States, she decided, OK, I'm a pharmacist. I'm going to open a pharmacy. And we're like, no, you can't do that. You're 60. You're retiring, right? And my mom, the baddie that she is, she's like, I'm going to do it, right? And she did it.

Ayesha

16:58 - 17:29

And she was successful doing it. So that was one of the things that inspired me when I was doing business, but realizing that a lot of small business owners, they don't really understand the art of business, the art of systems, the art of processes. And so they're just thinking, well, I have the skill, I'm going to do the skill. And then, you know, I'll just get this money this week and I will manage it this week or whatever it is. They're not signing contracts, they're not reviewing contracts, they're just signing dotted lines. they're not protecting their intellectual property.

Ayesha

17:29 - 18:19

So for a lot of them, they watch their sweat and tears that they've built be destroyed, or they don't last, which statistically, a lot of businesses don't make it even to the five year mark. So with the practice, I really wanted to impact whatever kind of clientele I was taking. Ultimately, our slogan ended up becoming, and currently is, Touching People Changing Lives. Basically, the goal, regardless of whether it was business or whether it was immigration, was that whoever came to this firm will touch and change their lives by them coming to this firm. And I firmly believe that for those clients who We got those intellectual property for, like got their trademarks for, which automatically makes and gives you leverage as a business owner, like values, you know, gives more value to your business.

Ayesha

18:20 - 18:31

To those who now have the ability to work and live freely in the United States, those are life-changing things. So that, that was the idea, but we didn't know exactly how we would do it. But

Lola

18:31 - 18:57

you had a North Star, and I think that's important to stress. You have an idea of what you want it to be, which I think it's, we can get into this now, but it's part of the business savvy part of setting up something, being intentional. If you're going to go do this, make sure you have at least a clear idea of what that's going to look like. Because I know you're also intentional about your back office too, right? The people supporting the firm, you're nodding your head. And yeah, I don't know if you want to talk about that but

Ayesha

18:57 - 19:35

oh yeah, oh yeah, it is, you know, again, I think that having a business background. Also been getting a Masters of Green Human Resources when I was trying to do. Human Resources really helped me to understand the people capital and understanding that your people as a business owner are part of what makes you successful. You have to, first of all, make sure that you understand the core value of your business. What is the core value of your business? You know, and you cannot be hiring people who do not align with that value because it's like one bad, what is it?

Ayesha

19:35 - 20:11

One bad apple spoils a bunch, right? You know? When you, you know, the analogy I'd like to use, and, you know, all my team will tell you this, you know, listen, Walmart or Neiman Marcus, right, you can buy a white t-shirt from both of them, but there's a different feeling you get when you get one in that gray plastic bag versus you get that one wrapped in tissue and a box and a bow. Right. It is the exact same t-shirt. And so I knew that when we were bringing in staff, you know, when we were serving people, I want people to know It is an experience.

Ayesha

20:11 - 20:46

You're getting value for what it is when you come in here. We're not the cheapest, but we will be the most quality and we'll get you the results you want. Most clients that complain about their attorneys complain because there's a lack of communication or a lack of follow up. And so these were things that when we went in to starting our hiring process and retaining clients, that we implemented in our system. And I keep using the word we because my husband left his corporate job to become our COO. You know, he has a background in business intelligence.

Ayesha

20:47 - 21:23

So he was able to bring that, you know, into the firm and just really help with the systems and process. So we knew that with staff, they had to understand that because it's much harder when you grow. to start fixing things. So you always have to start organized. So I was basically practicing what I preached to my business owners. When you start, what is your system? Are you co-mingling funds? How are you planning for the future? How are you budgeting for next year? How are you prospecting your marketing? Are you meeting with your team to discuss oversight?

Ayesha

21:23 - 21:58

What can we do better? What are people complaining about? So these are all things that I started even when it was just two of us and an assistant. When I say two of us, I mean my husband and I and one assistant. So we started that. from then and we'll have our charts and we'll be going over this month this is what it looked like you know let us look at our demographics where we're getting most people from which um platform is bringing the most clicks and stuff like that and i think because both of us had our synergy you know really really aligned which is funny because I never thought that I'd be able to work with my husband, you know?

Ayesha

21:58 - 22:37

Right. I was going to say, that's a big one. I know for most of us women and being African women, there's this whole thing of deference and just being, you know, respectful and wanting to make sure that you'd be able to have a voice, you know, in the workspace without it feeling that you're being disrespectful to your partner, but also understanding. So for me, I had to make sure that my partner and I had an understanding and an alignment that outside of work, I'm your wife, you know, whatever. And when we come into the office, how can we manage our relationship to make sure that we can separate our marriage?

Ayesha

22:38 - 23:14

Because at the end of the day, we have the exact same goal. Meaning if we're successful, we are successful, right? And ultimately our family is successful. So for me, that means also, if I don't agree with something, being able to express that in a way that's respectful and still, you know, making sure that the person knows that their opinion is valuable. And then also for him, also understanding that If he has a different opinion, that he has to bring it to me in a certain way, because our personalities truly are different. You know, my husband is more of a risk taker, you know, I'm more measured.

Ayesha

23:15 - 23:50

So we meet in the middle, you know, so. or create a risk, he has to show me everything and why that would work. And if I want to be measured, I have to show him why it would work. But one thing that we learned, and one of my favorite quotes I tell other business owners is, your speed of growth is determined by the speed of your implementation. So a lot of times, we consume knowledge. We're consuming podcasts. We're consuming coaches, mentors. whatever, but Lola, how many people implement what they learn?

Lola

23:51 - 23:51

Yeah,

Ayesha

23:51 - 24:43

that's a good one. Yeah, and so because he is someone that is very quick, very quick, we don't have time to waste. Like, what are we doing? And me, I'm like, well, can I just think about this? So we have to find that middle ground to meet. And that was decisions we were making when we were making this growth. Now we have a staff of 52 people. 52? Whoa, that's amazing. So to think where we came from, from two to 52, but again, it had a lot to do with that synergy and being prepared when it was time to grow, to understand that you have to grow to be able to serve more people, to be able to offer more impact, but part of growth means that you also have to have your systems and process in place because if not, it would be a disaster.

Lola

24:44 - 25:15

Yeah. Wow. There's a lot to unpack there. First of all, that's amazing growth, which is probably going to explain what I'm going to share in a second. But I just want to touch on something you said. So you obviously have this business with your husband and he left corporate to do that. Was there anything tangible that you guys did? I know you talked about just making sure you're respectful at work and at home and how you bring stuff, but culturally, you know, technically you're the lawyer. Yeah.

Ayesha

25:16 - 25:48

So the, the most tangible thing that people did, we did, and, you know, people say, Oh, what's your secret? What'd you guys do? And people don't believe this is that we're people of faith and we pray. It is God. Let me tell you, Lola, you know, it is God. Because I remember when we started and you have, you know, at the time, you know, my husband hadn't joined me. It was just kind of me doing this, but this is when I said, Oh, I'm going to do immigration. And, you know, he had ideas about how to do it or what we should do.

Ayesha

25:48 - 26:21

And again, because he has that background, it's like, I think this is how we should market it. Because like my husband runs the entire marketing show. And, um, I was like, I'm, I'm kind of fed up. Like this stuff is stressing me out. Like I do all those things. Nobody's showing up and the phones are not ringing. Like, yeah, I'm exhausted. And I know my husband said to me, I know that it's hard for you to believe it. You know, my husband has always had so much faith in me, by the way, even when I was a dazzled photography, he would come with me like on the weekends and help me be my assistant and be my, my carry my bags.

Ayesha

26:21 - 26:58

And it's, again, my husband's a Nigerian Igbo man that's very, very Igbo. Shout out. We're going to shout him out, yes. But he is wonderful and understands that marriage works in partnership. And I know he told me, he said, I know that I don't have any right to tell you to not quit, but I still believe in you. I still believe in this. If it doesn't work this month, then you can quit. So we decided that week in church, They were, you know, shout out to the gathering place in Florida. They were doing like a fasting and said couples should learn to fast together and pray together.

Ayesha

26:58 - 27:35

That week we decided to fast. That week was the busiest week. we had in immigration. Well, let me also add something to this. That week when I was saying that I was ready to give up, at that point I had started applying to other law jobs. And I actually had interviews that were promising and would give me an offer. And in the prayer that we prayed that day when I was having the meltdown and crying, you know, I don't know what possessed me, but I said to God, I said, if It is your will that I continue on this path.

Ayesha

27:37 - 28:13

Shut every single interview door that has a promising offer and show me. And it takes a lot of faith and fear because that is a dangerous pair because your will might not be the same as God's will. But that was our most, at that point, our most successful week. in immigration, but it was all because I told him, I said, if you show me, I will never put in another job application again, because I will trust you. So since that time, my husband and I have always fasted every month, at the beginning of every month.

Ayesha

28:14 - 28:52

I think this is something that is very important to couples, for couples, if you are a person of faith, fasting and praying together, because prayers is where you're vulnerable, right? And you talk about things. And I've noticed that when me and my husband are not connected, then things recede slow. But once we're connected through prayer, We see, we see the impact is almost immediate. It's almost immediate. And that's why I say that is the one single thing that we decided that we were going to pray together about our future, our family, our business. You know, we pray over our clients, we pray over our staff and everything we do.

Ayesha

28:53 - 29:08

And it's, you know, a lot of couples don't do that. Yeah. You know, we all go to church on Sunday, but this fasting. And so we've been doing that since 2019. To me, that was, the most important thing that we've done as a couple towards this place where we are.

Lola

29:08 - 29:35

I love that you shared that. And thank you for sharing that. I actually got me a little emotional because I think, um, yeah, and I know you did too, because you were going back in time, but you know, we're going to switch it up because you know, I still want to go into the woman behind the business. Cause I think you've done an amazing job just sharing that. And thank you for getting to the part about how you and your husband make it work, because I think that's so cool to share. But you know, one big thing you did talk about your term being 52 people.

Lola

29:36 - 29:37

But what you did mention

Ayesha

29:37 - 29:38

was

Lola

29:38 - 29:44

that you were recently recognized on Inc. 5000, actually top 1,000. I think your number was like 809, right?

Ayesha

29:45 - 29:46

Which is a

Lola

29:46 - 29:59

big, you know, for my day job, I know how hard it is to get on that list. You have to make certain amounts of money or revenue to get to that list. And to get even that high on a list of 5,000 is crazy hard to do.

Ayesha

29:59 - 29:59

And in law

Lola

30:00 - 30:20

firms, we're at number 10. Oh, look at that. In the country. In the country. That is amazing. Congratulations, Ayesha. Thank you, Lola. But I know how hard it is to get on the list from work. And so I just wanted to acknowledge that because it's obviously a testament to the work you're doing. But do you remember when you found out That the moment when you got the email

Ayesha

30:20 - 30:58

and it's an email, by the way. Yeah, there is an email. And we were actually in Venice when we found out it was actually a summer break, you know, in Italy. And when I got the email and, you know, I showed my husband, you know, we, we literally had to sit and take a pause. We had to sit and take a pause because like the idea little us, Immigrants, because my husband's an immigrant too, right? Immigrants from Africa, in a space where people like us don't get here. actually got here, you know, it was like an out-of-body experience.

Ayesha

30:58 - 31:41

Till today, it still feels like an out-of-body experience. You know, that's why, like, you know, for instance, you know, I say I have to 52 people. Most people don't know that because, because sometimes it's like, you're living in your dream, but it is shocking that we created this thing based on our synergies in our dreams. So that moment was, It was shocking. It was shocking because, you know, my story would not put us here, you know. But again, it shows that nothing is impossible. Don't give up. If you have a dream, don't give up. It's cliche to say You just have to take a tangible step every day towards achieving your dream.

Ayesha

31:42 - 31:57

Because it's not just having a dream, right? You have to take the tangible steps to get to your dream. And if nobody else takes anything from that, it's get up and go. Implement. Implement what it is that you're trying to do.

Lola

31:58 - 32:08

Wow, that's well said. So let's go to the woman behind the scenes. So earlier you talked about bedazzled photography. First of all, do you still do photography work?

Ayesha

32:09 - 32:15

No, I don't. I stopped that a long time ago. I do, of course, take pictures of my kids, but that's as far as it

Lola

32:15 - 32:41

goes. But how did you just even unleash in that creative side of you help? How does that help your business today? Because you talked about systems, processes, which to me is actually very, I wasn't expecting you to be that process oriented, not just by virtue of being a lawyer. You see that more on the engineering side, right? The science driven side. But I'm curious how your creative side also drives the success

Ayesha

32:41 - 32:41

of your

Lola

32:41 - 32:41

practice.

Ayesha

32:43 - 33:22

I think that my creative side has a lot to do with part of my aesthetics and what it is I want a client to feel when they step into this environment. Lawyers tend to be very scary and the idea that you're going to a lawyer is very buttoned up. I've always wanted to be relatable, even down to my color. Before everybody else started adding pink to their branding, my business colors were pink and yellow. Why? Because those colors are warm. They make you happy. And people underestimate you when you have that color. So some of that came from that.

Ayesha

33:22 - 33:57

And I think my creativity and being a photographer influenced even how I show up on social media. I'm very, very deliberate about my brand and how i want the cohesiveness of my brand to look not just in messaging but just in the visual i'm not gonna have like red and like purple you know when my colors are like pink and yellow i want pictures that are aesthetically eye-pleasing because it makes people gravitate towards that information um and say oh let me look at this this looks interesting and stuff like that so i think that's kind of what I brought here.

Ayesha

33:58 - 34:06

So I really value quality photographs, quality videos, you know, and all of that came from being, you know, a professional photographer.

Lola

34:07 - 34:31

Um, it's interesting that you talked about yellow and pink, cause I do remember that about you and yellow is my favorite color. So I was already drawn to that automatically. And so I guess one more thing before we switch gears here is, um, I'm just curious how you celebrate your client's victories, especially in immigration, just knowing how demanding that job is. And that role is how do you celebrate your clients when they, when they get that green card? Ah,

Ayesha

34:33 - 35:01

Well, I love giving them phone calls, you know, it's so funny because it started out as just phone calls, you know, updating them on your case. And, you know, we said, let's try something. Let's post an audio recording of the pure joy of when someone receives an approval. And now everyone that hires us, one of the things they say is, God, I pray that I get that phone call one day. I want to be one of those people that, you know, you hear my voice saying that, you know, you're giving me good news and. stuff like that.

Ayesha

35:01 - 35:34

And, you know, for our team, it's important for me to tell them the story of each client that is successful because, you know, sometimes jobs can be monotonous and you're just like, well, I'm just doing a job for a paycheck. I don't want to be the only one that understands the impact of the case or the legal assistant or the paralegal that dealt with the case. So whenever we have like, especially really tough ones in the team chat, I always like to tell the journey of this person. and help the team understand that every single one of you is a contributing factor to this victory.

Ayesha

35:34 - 36:12

Because it gives them that gusto to continue the work that they do, because it is a very challenging job, especially in 2025. With immigration being at the spotlight, it's very, very demanding. And so that's how we do it. We deal with a lot of victims of domestic violence, human trafficking, commercial sex trafficking, and serious crimes. So it stops certain things that I would love to do. Like one of the things that I wanted to do was I've always wanted to be able to like mail like a little box of something like, you know, welcome to America and stuff like that to our clients.

Ayesha

36:12 - 36:36

But with immigrants, a lot of times their locations are like this, you know, where they're left and right here. They're living here. They're not living here. They don't want their abuser to know what's going on. So it's really hard to do those things and maintain confidentiality. But I would love to do something like that and we continuously think about how we can do it without anybody else knowing what's going on with them.

Lola

36:36 - 37:13

Well, obviously it's working, and that's why you got to where you got to. And you haven't even gone to the 10-year mark. So this is just amazing growth. So again, congratulations on that. So I want to switch gears, and I want to get to the woman now behind all of this, the mindset that's making you drive through. You talked about your faith. You talked about the support of your spouse. You talked about how you build your team. But I'm curious to know if there's anything else that you do in like your just day-to-day practice or week-to-week practice just to keep you on task, to keep you on that momentum of striving for what you dreamt about for yourself.

Ayesha

37:14 - 37:57

So for me, what I do to prepare for the week is that when I shut off on Friday, I do not turn on anything related to work. I do not receive email notifications until Monday. If it is an emergency, because of the kind of law we do, the first person you should be calling is 911, meaning there's nothing I can do for you on Saturday, no matter what. But the thing is, I had to learn to do that and shut off to recover, because again, it is a highly stressful area of law, and you're dealing with very painful cases.

Ayesha

37:58 - 38:32

very stressful cases that for me being able to it's almost like a reset okay game time Monday that's something I do and another thing that I do is that I am very laser focused when I'm at work you know a lot of people you know you work a little bit let me just check Instagram let me just check Facebook for me my time here is valuable because I'm a mother and so When I'm done with consultations and I'm reviewing or writing briefs or reviewing my attorney's briefs or whatever it is, I tell myself I have from this time to this time.

Ayesha

38:32 - 39:08

Because when I log off here, I'm going to be a mom. That has helped me to be very efficient during the work day because I know that I'm not going to be taking that home. Even though in 2025, I've been taking a little bit home with me. It's too much, you know, and, you know, wanting to just balance, but generally I think for me, that is my balance because, again, I'm a mother and there's nothing more important to me than my children having me and needing me. They're teenagers. Being able to be there, review their work with them, go over things they don't understand.

Ayesha

39:08 - 39:41

Because I'm a lawyer, I'm very good at English and papers, so wanting to teach them how to write their papers and understand the prongs of questions being asked is something that I feel like I have a strength in so I definitely help them with it and you know just like right now they're new debaters and of course I'm a lawyer so like you know I coach them on debating and really being able to always see both pro and con. So for me, those things, I try to separate them and know this is a time for this and this is a time for that.

Ayesha

39:41 - 39:47

And I think that helps me to be very productive because I know the window I have to do that job.

Lola

39:48 - 39:57

Wow. So how have you navigated a setback? It could be from maybe when you have a client that it just did not go the way you were hoping.

Ayesha

40:00 - 40:30

Let me tell you a recent one. You know, people don't listen to their doctors or lawyers ever. If you're trying to travel outside the United States, make sure you reach out to us. Make sure you let us know because if you're out, what happens if your case gets denied? Reach out to us so we know. What is where you're traveling to? And we can approve that trip and say, okay, you're safe to travel. Because for those of you who don't know, once you've overstayed your time here, if you travel and you've been an overstay for more than a year, you're looking at a 10 year ban.

Ayesha

40:30 - 41:04

Like you will not be able to enter back into the United States. Okay. So this client leaves the country. We don't know that the client leaves the country. We get an email saying that a decision has been made on this client's case and the client's case has been denied. This literally is the greatest fear I have every single day, where a client's case is denied while they're outside of the country. And so at this point, we don't know that the client is outside the United States. So we're like, oh. So we're like, why is this client denied?

Ayesha

41:05 - 41:41

And we call the client to let the client know. Luckily, in me assessing the denial, I see that the client This is a mistake. This client shouldn't have been denied. This is a mistake. This is because, you know, according to USCIS, they sent a notice. Nobody received that notice. There's evidence that nobody received that notice or whatever it is. And I called the client and the client is like, oh yeah, I'm outside the country. I was like, Oh, my God. I was like, you need to hang up this phone, pack your bags, and get to the airport immediately.

Ayesha

41:41 - 42:15

You know, I was like, listen, just say a Hail Mary, a prayer, a Jesus, whatever you worship, just start praying right now. Again, faith is such a big part of my practice. Like, when clients come in and say, I don't care if you believe in Jesus or not, but listen, you have a Jesus follower, and I pray over my clients, you know, and I said, listen, Right now, you need to pray. So we immediately activated in gear by sending out a rebuttal to USCIS saying, this is an error. Activated the congressional assistance, like with a local congressman, this is wrong, or whatever it is.

Ayesha

42:15 - 42:46

And then a couple of days later, Client tells us, I took the travel permit that he had to the airport, and they allowed me in back in the country. And then three days later, the decision was reversed, and his case was approved, and he got his green card. Let me tell you the cartwheel that we're doing. And I told him, you are so lucky. That truly is the greatest fear of anyone that's in this practice. Because it's not that people don't get denied. It's that you get denied, and you wouldn't have any option. you'll be stuck.

Ayesha

42:46 - 43:23

And that was someone that his case was going so well. So we'll see what the new setbacks are going to be in 2025. Because there's a lot that's changing now. And you continually pray that your clients are listening to you and not making decisions that could impact their cases. Because sometimes clients make those decisions and it's different when you're making those decisions in an administration that is not this hostile to immigrants, but in this, even a speeding ticket will get you deported. You have to be very mindful of following the law, and if your lawyer is telling you don't do this, don't do it.

Lola

43:24 - 43:37

Listen, that is the takeaway. Listen, listen. Awesome. Awesome. All right. So I think just one more thing, and then we're going to go into a fun round of lightning questions. Cause you're an entrepreneur, you're a successful entrepreneur.

Ayesha

43:38 - 43:38

You

Lola

43:38 - 43:56

have a practice, which again, that's amazing. I didn't know you had 52 people. What is the one thing that you would advise any of our listeners who are either thinking about doing their own thing or, you know, they just know that there is something more in them? And I like to now call that moment the pivot

Ayesha

43:56 - 44:34

into purpose. I think laser focus because if you listen to everything that I've talked about it's about laser focus whether that was taking the bar exam whether that was making pivotal changes whether that was implementing something we learned you know or whatever it is you know it is basically not not just stopping at dreaming or saying you know I would love to do this But the thing is, in manifesting what you want to do, because I do believe in manifestation of what it is that you desire, whether that's you as a Christian, or whether that's you just channeling the universe, whatever route you want to call it.

Ayesha

44:34 - 45:09

But I believe that when you put things plain on paper and say, this is what I want to do, And you can physically see it, whether you're writing that down on a planner. In our own house, we had a vision board in our bedroom that we looked at every day. Your mind and your prayer points subconsciously prepares you and plans you. to do the things that would inch you closer to your goal, which is, oh, you're looking at that. You want to accomplish that. You want to build a six figure business. You want to build a seven figure business, an eight figure business, but you're sitting down here.

Ayesha

45:09 - 45:56

Well, what do I need to do? Who do I need to call? Yes. Are people going to close the doors on you? yeah, you know, not everyone is going to want whatever it is that you're offering. But the key is if you believe in what you're doing, just don't give up because most people that are successful didn't just become successful overnight or have tried other things before they became successful. It's just that you don't know their story. So you just have to keep going. Don't give up. But laser focus, on those things that you've put in your vision board or in your planner or wherever you're putting it, your journal, that's saying, this is what I'm trying to do and remove the noise because also sometimes the noise around you can be a dream killer or a dream stealer.

Ayesha

45:57 - 46:11

So if you know, and sometimes that could be friends and family. Because, and you know Lola, it's not that the friends and family have a bad wish for you because a lot of times it's coming out of concern for you

Speaker 3

46:11 - 46:12

and

Ayesha

46:12 - 46:49

what they believe that you're capable of doing or sometimes because they know that they're not capable of doing it, they're fearful that you won't be capable of doing it or that you will be capable of doing it and you might surpass them. So you have to, so that laser focus includes quiet the noise and don't speak about what you're doing until you've implemented what you're doing. Because people's synergy or energy can change the outcome. It's not like anyone is sitting in a calabash in the middle of the forest, like in your, out of like doing like voodoo or like something like that.

Ayesha

46:51 - 47:23

It's that, you know, people's energy can change the outcome. There's a phrase, you know, in the Bible that says, you know, Jesus couldn't perform miracles in his own hometown. But is it because Jesus was not able to perform miracles? No, it's because of the energy of the people there. So if you know that you have this friend or family member that's going to destroy your vision because they're negative Nancy or Betty or Susie, Keep quiet and do what you need to do. Sometimes your best resources are people who don't know you.

Lola

47:24 - 47:31

Ooh, that is well said, Ayesha. So spot on. And I love what you said about vision boards. I actually have a vision board as well.

Ayesha

47:32 - 47:32

And so I

Lola

47:32 - 48:12

do believe in the practice of manifestation. And I think that's even a separate conversation on another day, because some people mistaken that for derating from your faith with God, which I think there's a misunderstanding there. But again, that's a different conversation. All right, so we're going to do the fun stuff, the lightning round. and um it's funny you've not i know a fun fact about you that you've not said but i wonder if it's i wonder if it's gonna come out in this uh lightning round so there's no wrong answer just say what comes to your mind and um so we're gonna start from and you you also said some quotes but i wonder if there's any personal mantra words that you live by uh

Ayesha

48:17 - 48:45

Let's see. I mean, for me, it's just, it's really not a quote. It's just, I believe in laser focus, laser focus in anything that you're doing. Like your vision has to be in the tunnel, straight and center, because you know, all the schools, they're wonderful. The fastest way to growth is the speed of implementation. But what I live by is focus, laser focus.

Lola

48:46 - 48:50

I love that. And then what matters most to you? What do

Ayesha

48:50 - 49:23

you hope your legacy is going to be? My children, you know, those are the most important thing to me. The reason why I'm doing what I'm doing for me, even as a mother and as the mother to girls, it is important that they see a woman that is in this space and successful and has a successful marriage and seeing what a healthy marriage looks like. where your ambition is not shunted or that you don't have a voice. And so it is important to me that my children are happy and that they can thrive, you know, on a daily basis.

Ayesha

49:23 - 49:34

So everything I do, um, whether that's helping them financially, mentally, emotionally, that is the most important thing because all of this at the end of the day, doesn't matter. You know, my kids matter. Oh,

Lola

49:37 - 49:39

that was a moment when I loved that. Your greatest fear.

Ayesha

49:41 - 49:43

My greatest fear is being broke.

Lola

49:44 - 49:55

Oh, that's a, that's, that's a real thing. Yeah. All right. So three words to describe you as the Kadar woman, what would it be? Fun. Okay.

Ayesha

49:56 - 50:11

Um, you know, I love love. I love love. You know, maybe that's why I help like, you know, clients in their marriages or photography. And I watch a lot of things like love is blind that we share in common. And what else? Grit.

Lola

50:12 - 50:23

I like that. And, um, you're building this business. You're still building. You're always going to be building your, you have aspirations, but what is the last thing you learned or what are you learning now? Right now, let's see, what am

Ayesha

50:24 - 50:54

I working on or learning right now? Well, outside of the immigration. And it could be anything, by the way, it could be any, anything. You know, right now, I've actually been reading a book by another baddie friend of mine called Power of Manifestation. Maybe that's why I'm talking so much about manifestation. Her name is Takoa Parry. And she has this book out and it just talks about just different avenues of our lives, you know, and just how we overcome fear and because she is a pastor. In what, in, in line with what you were saying about how people can feel that it's a derailment of your fate.

Ayesha

50:54 - 51:33

It's not because you know, there are biblical passages that connect to, you know, calling things that are not as if they are and just believing it because you pray enough times about it, you know, what is it? the fervent prayer of a righteous woman avail it much. So it all still is in line with that. So I've been reading that. It's like on my bedside right now. And I've been doing a lot of reading and highlighting on things and just also teaching my children about that, because I want them to learn that at this age and about how if you believe and you want and desire something, you have to pray for it and believe that you're going to get it.

Lola

51:34 - 51:48

That's good. Actually, that's great. Because my next question was going to be your favorite book, but you just gave us a book. So that just checks that box. All right. So what would you tell the 17-year-old girl who was working in the first job at a gas station in New York? If

Ayesha

51:48 - 51:48

you could go back

Lola

51:48 - 51:49

to talk to her,

Ayesha

51:49 - 51:50

what would you tell

Lola

51:50 - 51:51

her? It's going

Ayesha

51:51 - 52:15

to be all right. You didn't know that was going to happen, right? I didn't know that was going to happen. Yeah, it's going to be all right. You know, I remember like those walks. I used to have my headphones on walking three miles in Poughkeepsie, upstate New York home. And I used to sing this song. It says, I am on my way. I know that one day I'll be strong. I know that one day I'll be successful. It's a Disney movie. I'm trying to remember whether it was Anastasia or whatever. I am on my way.

Ayesha

52:15 - 52:56

Someday I'll be strong. That was the first single I got on Kadara. Oh my God. I love it. I would have my headphones on because I felt so down, you know, coming from Nigeria, like being like, you know, very popular and like living life well in Nigeria and then coming here wearing a burgundy polo shirt with a burgundy cap, like at a gas station. But I was doing that to pay for college. But you just don't see a path or a way out. So going back now, I would tell her, it will be okay. This is part of your story because if those things didn't happen, maybe you wouldn't be where you are because you wouldn't have anything driving you.

Ayesha

52:57 - 53:36

to be there or driving you to make sure that your children, you are setting up a legacy for them in the way that you didn't have. You know, like my husband and I always say, this is our favorite couple quote, where we say that we didn't come from wealth, but wealth must come from us. You know, our children, we must leave a legacy that is lasting past their generation. Because for people that look like us, it is not part of our parents or their parents' planning, you know, generally. And not because in their hearts they didn't want to do it, but it's not something that they were taught to do or they had the resource to do.

Ayesha

53:37 - 53:46

But why would we be in this position or why would God put us in this position if we cannot be good stewards to the future generation?

Lola

53:47 - 53:53

Ooh, that was good. Wow. All right. And so let's see. Um, what is your greatest achievement to date?

Ayesha

53:54 - 54:01

Um, outside of my children, um, this, um, firm. That's

Lola

54:01 - 54:03

actually very impact driven too,

Ayesha

54:03 - 54:04

which I

Lola

54:04 - 54:09

love. Last question. What would you say about destiny and how it's helped you pursue your purpose?

Ayesha

54:10 - 54:42

That is a great question because I think that my destiny was tied to my husband's destiny because if I didn't meet him or we didn't get married, we would not be here. Because again, not everyone would have allowed their wife take the lead in any area. or believe in her so much so that you push her to her destiny. Because everything that I've done in the legal space, my husband pushed me,

Speaker 3

54:42 - 54:43

kicking

Ayesha

54:43 - 55:01

and screaming, to my destiny because he would always say that, I believe in you, you can do it. I'm telling you Ayesha, you will be successful. Because most people wouldn't do that. Because if I ended up with someone else, I may never have lived this.

Lola

55:02 - 55:09

wow that we brought the tears at the end that was that was heartfelt oh shout out to him well

Speaker 3

55:09 - 55:10

yeah i

Lola

55:11 - 55:55

wasn't sure if you wanted to say his name because you don't want anybody to go for my husband exactly Exactly. But, you know, Ayesha, this was amazing. And I just appreciate you sharing. Oh, I loved it. And I hope the listeners got multiple nuggets. I was just clicking away and taking notes. And I just want to say thank you for sharing because... Oh, thank you for having me. Yeah, no, this was a good, good conversation. After talking to Ayesha, I was actually inspired to create another podcast on relationships. But I digress, I digress. I love how open Ayesha was about everything, from finding her purpose, working with her husband, and the importance of creating systems from day one as a business owner.

Lola

55:56 - 56:35

And then the part where she talked about, you know, we didn't come from wealth, but wealth came from us, a must come from us, that resonated with me. If you're someone who's thinking about a career pivot or building something from the ground up, I hope Ayesha's insights on being laser-focused coupled with her fate inspire you to move. And if you enjoyed this conversation as much as I did, please subscribe, share with a friend who needs to hear this, and also follow us on social media, @Kadarawoman, for more conversations with remarkable African women. Until next time, this is Lola reminding you that your Kadara Moment of clarity may have already happened, and all you need to do is embrace it.